NetBSD/pc532 Frequently Asked Questions

Main Board photoplot is done (George, anything I should check for ?) Serial piggy back Board photoplot not done yet.

Anyone who feels like getting us quotes from board manufacturers, please go ahead, all the info's up for ftp, help yourself :-)

Thanks to Phil, NetBSD now runs on the PC532 :-) .... If we increase the number of ET532 boards made, it's cheaper, so: 2 Scenarios:

No doubt the class (2); guy might prefer an ICU & FPU too, but nobody's doing a PC532 PCB run so that option is not available Anyway, maybe class (2); folk might increase total board quantity & reduce prices for us class (1) folk ? Is this daft ? or Should we offer it to the Net & Free BSD lists ? Comments Please.

George long ago wrote:

Michael Hermann & Steve Liggett asked stats on PCBS, to get us prices, well I havent counted number of holes on pcb (freq Q. that), but:

ET532 Layers:

No surface mount devices as per PC532 (I assume George ?) I presume we call this `6 layer' as far as PCB manufacturers are concerned ?

Daughter Board Layers:

The 2 serial chips go on the piggy back serial card. I asked George Scolaro:

	> > - Do we also need to make piggy back octart PCBs ?
	> Only if you want to have more serial ports.
	Looking at George's ET532 schematics:
		The ET532 can take 2 * SCC2698, each 2698 supports
		EIGHT serial ports ! The optional `piggy back' board
		has 16 * 145406, 16 * DIL Headers, Caps, & 2 Long DILs
		to connect to ET532 main board.
	For the ET532 to function just as an ethernet card, it should not be
	necessary to populate the 2698 sockets, nor to have a piggy back card.
	I do however foresee need for a few of us to have one serial port,
	as I guess software development'll probably go in 3 stages:
		1 Write/debug eprom for ET532 to talk to a serial port
		  (& prove hardware design works)
		2 Extend ET532 monitor to talk over SCSI bus to some kind
		  of software interface on the PC532, so PC532 can download
		  code to ET532 & set breakpoints etc ?.
		3 Develop ET532 ethernet code & ET532/PC532 higher level
		  protocols etc.
	Main thing is to get the ET532 PCBs fabricated :-) .
	Daniel Berglund <db@etek.chalmers.se> wrote 3-94:
	> > > It's probably not hard to temporarily wire in a 2681
	> > >  (or whatever they are called,
	> > SCC 2698
	> Nope. I mean a 2681, they are cheaper.  That's my point: if you
	> want only one serial port for debugging until the firmware is done,
	> then you probably want to avoid expensive octuarts (2698).
	

All these are very old figures, & need to be confirmed: Bryan Davis bdavis@netcom.com said

		> from the Bay Area....
		>  Hamilton/Avnet (a distributor for National)
		>		 1-24	 25-99	 100+
		> NS32GX32-ANU20  $110.00 $95.00  $86.50
		> NS32532-25	  $825.00 $685.00 $595.00

Mark_Geisert@l66a.ladc.bull.com said

		> Bell Industries, a NatSemi distributor in California,
		>		  QTY1-24     QTY25-99	  QTY100-999
		> NS32GX32U-20	    90.00	 78.50	       71.00
		> NS32GX32U-25	   100.00	 91.00	       83.00
		> NS32GX32U-30	   120.00	105.00	       95.00

johnc@manatee.UUCP (john connin) Wed, 7 Oct 1992 19:16:47 GMT said:

		> it might be easier and cheaper to pull the ethernet
		> related parts from a no-name 8-bit ethernet card.
		Are the parts the same as I posted in George's build list ?

Could someone please ask at a US West Coast IC shop, what an IC kit price would cost, as per build list (presumably a) excluding GX32, b) 1 off & ~25 off pricing ). ( I believe jkh@whisker.hubbard.ie can provide names of California IC shops for someone in the USA to phone. )

The ether-bom (Bill Of Materials) is available via ftp to enable pricing exercises. Don't ask me, I'm in the wrong country for cheap or easily available prices, VOLUNTEERS PLEASE !

This PCB order list does NOT commit you to IC purchase, If short of cash, you can enroll on what will be a once only ET532 cheap PCB fabrication run, then some time later buy the ICs. I dont know board cost yet, as soon as I do I'll post the info, As always, no one's done a chip costing exercise, so as always, before people ask, Nope ! I don't know ! Photoplots'll were free (I'll probably buy the guy a meal to say thanks)

Hopefully someone(s) will consider doing IC bulk purchase & kit distribution. (doesnt need to be same person who does pricing investigations, but shouldnt be me, USA should be better purchase & distribution point than Germany) Steve Liggett maybe ?

Dave Rand <dlr@daver.bungi.com> mailed to say

(so I assume you want 3 PCBs bdale ? ) “Rennolet (Kumar)” <rennolet@cs.umn.edu> said Wed Oct 7

21 May 1996: Mark Mason <mason@ease.com> interested in helping.

Please dont anyone mail me private questions about:

More can be learnt by looking at the Gerber diagrams. George long ago wrote:

IE “GO/NO GO” but no WIBNIs (Wouldnt It Be Nice If's) please, Thanks :-)

This periodic bulletin is produced by me to coordinate us, but the cards will not be produced without much help though, I'm too lazy/busy for anyone to rely on me pushing it as a one man band; right now next thing we need to do is confirm IC pricings. I shall ignore any email that asks `how much will the whole thing cost' (I've been asked before, often) - It's a valid & important question, but as I've said before, I dont know, I'd like to, but I don't. Please help us by getting quotes on 25 off chip sets !

Corrections to this file are welcomed, please mail me.

Please hand forward this notice to dormant pc532 friends who may have fallen off the pc532 list, or changed their mail address.

A = Number of ET532 PCBs you will pay for, ie
B = Number of optional Serial piggy back pcbs you will pay for
C = Number of glue chip IC kits you will later want.
D = Number of GX32 CPUs you will want
E = Email
F = Real Name
G = Date of last communication
H = Comment
@ = Date person last confirmed PCB order info.

# PCBs ; EMAIL shown by "From:" ; .signature EMAIL NAME ; HUMAN NAME ; COMMENT

SERIOUS INTEREST in 96
A B C D E				F		G	H
1 1 1 1	jhs@freebsd.org			Julian Stacey	@May96  $ Dependent
1 1 1 1 eyal@eyal.emu.id.au		Eyal Lebedinsky @May96  $ Dependent
1 1 1 1 admin@maxrnd.com		Mark Geisert	@May96
1 ? ? 0	leo@marco.de			Mathias Pfaller @May96 will swap 32532 chip for pcb
1 ? ? ?	phil@cs.wwu.edu			Phil Nelson	@May96 PCB <$100
1 1 1 1	mason@ease.com			Mark Mason	@May96 PCB <$100
1 1 1 1	n1epo4tl@ibmmail.com            Stuart Arnold	@May96  cond. on $
1 ? 1 1	sverre_froyen@nrel.gov		Sverre Froyen   @Apr96  cond. on $
? ? ? ?	jdl@jdl.com			Jon Loeliger	@May96
1 1 0 0 antsu@sandra.pp.fi		Antti-Pekka	@May96
1 0 1 1	Ian.Dall@dsto.defence.gov.au	Ian Dall	@May96
1 0 1 1	ricker@erols.com		Rick Rodman	@May96
1 1 1 1	kls@chicago.com			Karl Swartz	@May96
------------
From paz@world.std.com (Philip A Zimmermann)
Name		email			quant	date	comment
Dave Rand	dlr@daver.bungi.com	1	20May96	can src files
Robert Vincent	bert@willowpond.com	1?	20May96	maybe. $;parts avail?
P. Zimmermann	paz@world.std.com	1	20May96	do fab?
Lee Damon	nomad@castle.org	1	20May96	two hands, tho'.
Julian Stacey	jhs@freebsd.org		?	21May96	ET proponent
Sverre Froyen	sverre@sst.nrel.gov	1?	21May96	if < $?, parts avail?
Raymond Wiker	etorwi@eto.ericsson.se	1?	21May96	if bare pcb <$100
Mark Mason	mason@ease.com		1	21May96	write drivers for...
Eyal Lebedinsky	eyal@eyal.emu.id.au	1	22May96	want serial also
------------------

YES - DEFINITE PCB ORDER in 94
1 1 1 1 tbr@tfic.bc.ca                  Tom Rushworth   @Feb94
1 1 1 1 etorwi@hisoy.etn.ericsson.se	Raymond Wiker	@Feb94 Bd<$300 ex RAM
1 ? ? ?	pete@pelican.com		Pete Carah	@Feb94 Bd<$300 NoMain532 FreeBSD
1 1 1 1 fellows@unb.ca                  David Fellows   @Feb94
1 ? ? 0	via leo@marco.de		Tjeerd Mulder	@Feb94
1 0 1 1 neil@skatter.usask.ca		Neil Johnson	@Feb94
1 1 1 ?	marcb@werj.com.au		Marc Boschma	@Mar94
1 1 1 0	dlr@daver.bungi.com		Dave Rand	@Mar94
1 1 1 1 rjohnson@mpr.ca			Robbin Johnson	@Mar94 cond. on $
1 1 1 0	nomad@CASTLE.ORG		Lee Damon	@Mar94 < $100/pcb
1 1 1 1	khe@pcs.dec.com			KarlHeinz Eckmeier @Apr94
1 1 1 1	jonb@metronet.com		Jon Buller	@May96	BD<$100
	( Jon Buller, 2301 Pebble Vale #2121, Plano, TX 75075, (214) 422-3051 )
	( email goes away between semesters, but really wants one! )
	( email address from a 11-94 posting)
2 ? ? ?	bdavis@netcom.com		Bryan Davis	@Dec93

PEOPLE WHO'VE NOT MAILED YES/NO IN 1994 - PLEASE MAIL ME YES/NO
0 ? ? ?	gj@pcs.dec.com			Gary Jennejohn
1 ? ? ?	jkh@whisker.hubbard.ie		Jordan K. Hubbard
0 0 0 0	gs@chips.com			George Scolaro
1 0 ? ?	mch@regent.e-technik.tu-muenchen.de Michael Hermann
3 ? ? ?	bdale@gag.com + Fred & John	Bdale Garbee	If drvr
1 ? ? ?	rennolet@cs.umn.edu		Kumar Rennolet
1 ? ? ?	john.connin@OAU.ORG		John Connin
1 ? ? ?	ackley@banana.cis.ohio-state.edu john@softspace.com John James Ackley
0 0 0 0	sef@kithrup.COM			Sean Eric Fagan
0 0 0 0	glowell@allegro.com		Gary Lowell
0 0 0 0	frank@ginger.sri.com		Victor Frank
0 0 0 0	mem@zwac.mv.com			Mark Mallett
0 0 0 0	rhyde@ucrengr.ucr.edu		Randy Hyde
0 0 0 0	montana!asgard@convex		J.R. Stoner
0 0 0 0	david@marvin.jpl.oz.au		David Magnay
0 0 0 0	bolo@cs.wisc.edu		Joe Burger

NO DEFINITELY NOT
0 0 0 0	jvh@microsoft.com		Johannes Helander @ 21 May 1996
0 0 0 0	tom@lajax.pp.fi			Tom Javen	@Mar94
0 0 0 0	mattias@lysator.liu.se		Mattias Olofsson @Mar94
0 0 0 0	gtw@img.com.au			Grant Waldram	@Apr94 (info from marcb
--	--

From: paz@world.std.com (Philip A Zimmermann)
To: pc532@bungi.com
Subject: ET532 news.
Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 14:48:50 GMT

I started compiling a list of interested parties; I have to append
Julian's list from when things went dormant and contact those people to
see if they're still interested. Here's what I've got so far:

[ SEE MERGED LIST ABOVE ]

I'm currently working on the BOM, trying to source the difficult parts.
I'll get pricing when the number of participants is firmed up. I am
willing to help source the difficult parts (doing a quantity buy on the
'GX, etc. will probably help costs), but would rather not source the
popcorn & glue. Offhand, I'd say that it would be worthwhile to have
ET532 go to fab if the lot size is ~25.

I've had a good deal of experience dealing with pcb vendors over the
years, and especially lately. I appreciate the concern for keeping the
pcb fab cost down. My experiences lately have been with some vendors
who've done quick-turn jobs for us. Some of the consequences besides
higher costs have been poor quality, e.g. over-etching (where traces
disappear and the reappear an inch or so away), under-etching (causing
shorts between traces) and warpage (a problem if the product is a card to
be inserted into a cage). I know of companies which do high-quality work
and am hopeful that if we accept a longer delivery time, an acceptable,
affordable and reliable product will result. No one likes finding out
AFTER paying for and constructing a six-layer pcb that a few traces on
some buried (inner) layer are open-circuited or shorted out due to poor
fab quality. (Gets off soap-box.)

Some things are sketchy on the BOM; I'm hoping to submit my questions to
Dave Rand off-list for clarification, then add sourcing info to BOM.

I'm only interested in doing smaller step at a time, i.e., ET532 first, if
it's still practical. Then, if that works out and there's enough interest,
I may be prepared to help out with the serial daughtercard. I just don't
want to be overwhelmed with too much all at one time.